I was called / instructed by my Lord and Savior to study Revelation.
This is my personal testimony.
Definition of testimony; Telling what GOD DID while I was there.
My purpose is to explain a few circumstances / happenings that demonstrate how God
intervened in my life – things that I could not have done, did not understand nor would have
wanted to do. I was totally unworthy, unprepared and unable to do the things I was called to
do. But our God and Creator, Who is Holy, called me, prepared me and made me able to
understand. I am still unworthy – for the best I can do is worse than ‘dirty rags’.
First – my mother told many times (much to my embarrassment) how she dedicated me to the
Lord if He would help deliver such a large baby (9 ½ lbs.)
At 9 years of age I made my confession and was baptized at FBC Alice, Texas. At that time I
was given a new Bible. Although mom and dad with family read the Bible before bed, I always
had to read my Bible, myself, at my bed. If I did not I could not go to sleep – I would have to
turn the light back on – read and then I could go to sleep.
At 18 years of age the Lord called me to the ministry. I was lying in bed – very troubled in my
spirit. I understood that my troubled heart had to do with ministry. I said in my mind, ‘leave
me alone’ – the Lord left me. (An alone feeling). I was SOO alone – I pleaded for Him to come
back, but He did not. I promised I would NEVER say ‘leave me alone’ again. Although this
had an impact in my life, for years I would not allow ‘ministry’ to enter my mind. I was country
(dairy farmer), our pastor was Dr. Richardson – way up there at the front and I was country,
faithful, but on back row – I thought I COULD NOT do that.
At age 20 at a HS senior class party with Nancy, who would be my wife before that year was
gone, I experienced a premonition / vision or ?? whatever you may call it. We were sitting on
a couch in a room with probably 8 or 10 others, mostly Nancy’s classmates. A person across
from us was talking. I had the thought that a particular person to our right would speak next
and I understood what they would talk about. It happened just as I thought and they said
what I expected them to say. This is not strange as many people have premonitions / visions
or glimpse of things that later happen. For me --- at this time I began to question / ask --- why
do these things happen and why – what do they mean. When I began to ask the Lord – why –
then it seemed I really began to see more such things. In the course of time (years) I
realized this was not normal physical – so - then it was spiritual. Since it was spiritual – then
what is the source ?? – there are two possibilities – God or satan / demonic. Soo – came the
necessity to learn discernment of spirits. If it is the devil – to reject it ----- if it is from the
Lord, then what / why and how??
At 30 years of age --- married for 10 years, 2 daughters 9 & 6, driving new cars, living in nice
home, having taught Sunday School for several years, SS department director, youth
counselor, wife – Nancy on church staff as outreach director, ordained as deacon ------ good
family, good life, HAPPY. One evening as I exited the back door of our house I felt / sensed
an evil presence in the hedge under our bedroom window. I weighed 225, was in good
physical condition and did not think I was afraid of anything, but that evil scared you so that
for some time I would not exit that door at night. I did not understand it and did not want to
understand it, but I was forced to come to grips with the reality of evil presence / spirits.
Not long thereafter I had a horrible dream / nightmare. I dreamed that we as family were
swimming at a lake. Natalie, 2nd daughter, jumped from a pier and did not come up. I jumped
in, was swirling in the water looking for her, but could not find her. I awoke, wet with sweat
and scared to death. I was SOO afraid that I didn’t even tell my wife, but for a month or two I
prayed about this day and night until the burden was lifted. About 2 years later we went to a
lake with friends. AS we arrived at the lake property my friend handed me the keys to unlock
an entry gate. As I approached the gate, I looked and there were the trees, the pier –
everything I had seen in my dream. We swam – jumped from the pier – I was careful, but not
fearful because the burden had been lifted. I made another step in understanding spiritual
At age 37 I sold my trucking business took a 2 or 3 day trip with wife and kids in our motor
home returning home Saturday evening for church on Sunday. As walking down the hallway
at church a dear friend, Mrs. Waters, greeted me and proceeded to tell that she and her
husband had attended an ordination service on Saturday. She explained the person being
ordained was over 40 years old, had quit his job and surrendered to the ministry. She
concluded by saying to me, ‘Don can you imagine a person doing such a thing as that’. Those
words from Mrs. Waters pierced me completely through my heart and rang in my ears all day.
Please note; at that time of my life, I had a very nice family, very nice home, good cars, motor
home, money in the bank and expecting to buy a business in town from my neighbor across
the street --- life was good – no stress – no problems. That night I could not sleep. About
midnight I got up – went to living room couch – got on my knees and prayed aloud to my
Lord. I prayed, ‘----(confession) --- Lord If you want me to surrender to preach, please prove
it to me beyond a shadow of a doubt, if so I will do my best to obey and follow your will’.
Then, I went to bed – went to sleep. At 4 am I came up out of the bed – wet with sweat –
scared to death. I had a dream. My dream was: There was an ambulance backed up to our
front door with lights flashing and doors open. EMS persons were pushing a gurney down
the hallway with our eldest daughter on it and I was trying to explain to her why she had to
die. I immediately went to the living room couch and surrendered my life to the calling of my
Lord and Savior. That happened Monday May 1, 1978 – today is May 11, 2017 – 39 years ago
and I write this today with tears in my eyes. Answering God’s call is the GREATEST point in
my life and my Lord has proven His calling to be correct many times and blessed us greatly.
If I had at the beginning of my life imagined a life of adventure and reward / satisfaction I
could not have imagined a more exciting life than we have lived.
In the dream God showed me what could be the result of disobedience. My God knew how
to break my disobedient spirit and put me into a place where I would obey, ---- regardless of
the cost, whether I wanted to or not or whether it made sense or not. SIMPLY OBEY – the
greatest lesson a human can learn !!!
After my surrender to the Lord I awoke all the family and shared with them my decision. I told
them that their life would never be the same again – that certainly proved to be true. They
were a bit stunned but received it well. My family has been my helpers. On the third day
after the dream, on returning from Fort Worth to enroll in seminary I found no one at home.
After just a few minutes the phone rang – Nancy in a very anxious voice said, ‘Oh good you’
re home. I am at the doctor’s office with Donna (our eldest) – she has an extremely high
fever. The doctor wants to put her in the hospital immediately.’ I replied to her, ‘Let me talk
to the Doctor’. The Doctor quickly explained that Donna had severe mononucleosis – very
high fever – her life was at risk and she would be bedridden for at least 1 month. (The
Doctor was our neighbor and fellow deacon at FBC Buffalo). I explained to the Doctor my
dream, my surrender to ministry – that it was an evidence of the warning from our Lord and
please send her home – she will be OK. He very reluctantly agreed – gave us instructions of
how to treat Donna and they came home. 38 years later Donna is still in good health. Our
Lord warned me – showed me how easily tragedy can come – and how He can heal and take
care of us as needed. The Lord taught me thoroughly over many years – one step at a time.
Very soon I was called by small country church to be their pastor. Our 1st Sunday there was,
besides our family, 9 people present. They were discussing closing the church. We were
there a little more than 1 & a half years. Church attendance averaged about 50, baptized 6
people and had a bus load of kids for RAs & GAs on Wednesdays. I was totally amazed how
the Lord used / confirmed our work. 38 years later Ephesus Baptist Jewette, Texas is a large
At the end of fall semester 1979 the Lord put very strong thoughts in my mind to find another
church. He soon physically showed me that church – FBC Jourdanton, Texas. I called the
associational DOM and asked if that church had a pastor – he replied that they did not,
although they had been looking for over a year. I sent FBC Jourdanton a resume on a
Saturday. On Wednesday as returning home after church, I said to Nancy – if Jourdanton
received our resume, they may have opened it tonight after church and might be calling
about now. As I opened the door the phone rang. Marshall said, ‘This is FBC Jourdanton, we
would like to meet with you for an interview’ – then preached in view of call --- in 3 weeks we
were on our way to a new full-time church.
There is an important aspect that was part of this process ; I was taken out of range of
seminary. I loved my time at seminary. Our finances were good, family was good, I could
have finished a Diploma Degree with one more semester. The ONLY reason to not finish
seminary was – the LORD moved me to another church. I finished the courses I lacked by
correspondence, but did not turn all of them in, so as to receive credit. Not having a degree
concerned me – I thought should have one – but my Lord definitely -- took me from
seminary. The correctness of the Lord moving me to Jourdanton was seen both in the what
He did in the church and in me.
First – God’s work in the church; The church facility was very nice (only 2 years old) with an
automatic, fill and heat baptistry that had never been used. The folks at the church said that
their pastor’s son had been baptized about 4 years before and before that they didn’t
remember when someone else was baptized. Our 1st Sunday there February 3, 1980.
Average SS attendance at that time was 32. By April the church was full and carrying in
chairs to seat people. On a Wednesday evening service with about 15 people present, I
shared with them that I could see people – as holding on to the pews – needing to make
decision for Christ, but not able to do so. I had witnessed to some of them – They and I knew
the decision they needed to make. I said to the folks that Wednesday evening that we
needed to pray for God’s Holy Spirit to be present the coming Sunday with such power that
those could make their decisions. I also said – I am going to kneel here at the alter and pray,
if you feel – and only if our Lord leads you, please join me here at the alter. When I had
finished praying and stood, all except one person was with me at the alter. Sunday morning
the place was INTENSE, but no one came down. Sunday evening a 15 year old young man
came to speak to me before Church. He kinda blurted out – I don’t know what to do, but I
want to be baptized. I explained that a person could come forward at the closing song, I
would explain, we would pray and then request the church for baptism. He, Wiley replied
that he thought that was what I had explained Sunday morning, but he had never seen
anyone do that and was not sure what to do. At invitation, Wiley came forward – was saved
and was sooo happy. I asked him to come by the church after school and we would discuss
baptism. He did and we decided on baptism the following Sunday – Easter Sunday. I said to
Wiley – I think it would be good to have the baptism before the service, so that others like
him who had never seen decisions and baptism would see his testimony. At the invitation
that Easter Sunday 7 came for salvation and baptism and 3 by letter. After that April Sunday
there were decisions and baptism every Sunday through October. At the end of the church
year (September) we had baptized 37 people – more than the church had averaged in Sunday
School the year before. Church attendance was approximately 3 times the previous year.
This is not bragging, but giving testimony of what God did in the presence of a totally
unworthy, but called servant.
Second – God’s work in me ---; He taught me to stick to His Word, the Bible and speak it
boldly – be prepared at all times – to humble myself before Him and mankind – to meet
everyone as equals, etc. I learned that my Lord could speak so clearly that it seemed audible
– that He could heal the sick – that He could intervene in the lives of persons for whom we
prayed. I learned to speak as led by the Holy Spirit and that people of all ages would listen
and many would respond. I learned from my Lord and Savior – not from books, theological
studies, mentors or other preachers. I often desired a confidant – but only had my Lord – a
great lesson was ---- He was all I needed.
I pastored FBC Jourdanton for two years, then suddenly resigned on a Sunday morning. My
wife and family heard my resignation along with everyone else. My wife was quite shocked.
Why so suddenly and why that way??????
Just prior to Sunday resignation, we had held a revival meeting at FBC. I had spent some
time with the evangelist discussing the need for and ways and means of evangelism. He
had been reading about – and shared with me the need for evangelism on the west coast
and particularly the north west of USA. On Saturday night, before the Sunday a great fear
came over me. A fear in my spirit – fear about my relationship with my Lord, my salvation, my
life and my family. After many hours of prayer – confession, soul searching and pleading with
my Lord – then asking Him – what is wrong?? Having experienced being called as a
teenager, then answering that calling at age 37 as result of numerous dreams, intuitions,
visions, understanding much spiritual growth – I asked the Lord, aloud, what are You trying
to say to me?? The answer came immediately to my spirit – preach evangelism. (WE were
very happy at FBC and I had no inclination to leave). Then I began to pray asking – how and
where to ‘preach evangelism’ – radio or ??? I , in prayer reasoned with the Lord – if I were
on radio it could even be sent to the NW – Washington State / Seattle. When I prayed
Washington / Seattle the Lord spoke VERY clearly to my spirit, ‘Why don’t you go up there’??
I responded immediately – speaking aloud ‘I will’. A great peace came over me – everything
around me became VERY real and present to my spirit. It was such a powerful conformation
that I would stake / place my life upon it. I got ready to go to Seattle. My wife asked, ‘What
are you going to do’?? I replied, ‘ go to Seattle – get a room – get on my knees and ask the
Lord what to do’. That’s what I did – noon on a Friday. After prayer I called Puget Sound
Baptist Association – explained who I was and that I was looking for a pastorate. They said
that I could, if I desired, attend a brotherhood breakfast Saturday morning at Beverly Park
Baptist. I did so and met 3 persons who were on pulpit committees from different churches.
I went home with Bro. Tex and preached at his church next day – Sunday. After Sunday
evening service the church had a business meeting and extended a call to me to be their
pastor. My answer was – I would pray and let them know. Monday morning I called the
association office again – they had already talked to Bro. Tex. I was proven acceptable and
the secretary was instructed to give me a list of churches without pastors. I called the first
church on the list – visited with their leader and stayed the night with he and his wife. The
next morning as the Lady was preparing breakfast I went out raised the hood of my car to
check the oil. I looked up and there was Mount Rainier shining in the sun – first time I had
seen it through the clouds – then the song, ‘hit the road old Jack and don’t you come back
no more – no more’, went through my mind. I laughed at myself and asked the Lord, ‘Are You
telling me to leave this one’ – and He confirmed that to be so. I ate breakfast with the folks
and bit them farewell – drove down the street to a phone and called FBC Lacey – no answer.
I found Lacey on the map headed south on Interstate 5 and exited the first Lacey exit –
turned left on the first main street – casually driving along, having no address or directions.
After several blocks, I passed Mountain View Elementary and then on the corner was the
sign, First Baptist Church. I turned on to 22nd street and immediately into the church
parking lot. As the car entered the parking lot the Holy Spirit completely filled the car and
me. It was VERY obvious that this was the place my Lord was directing me. Within 3 weeks
we were on our way as pastor of FBC Lacey, Washington. MANY proofs and conformations of
our Lord’s detailed and sure leadership followed.
I have shared the above testimony as evidence / proof of God’s leadership. Where I was at
Jourdanton – I had no idea of such a place as FBC Lacey. My Lord took me there for a
purpose – evangelism – yes, in one church year we baptized 97 and there was more than 20
awaiting baptism. (Was not me – the church did it). But He also took me there to show me
the world. We, u-haul and all arrived to FBC Lacey on a Wednesday evening as the youth
choir was in practice. They welcomed us by singing in 7 languages. (After Lacey the Lord
called me to volunteer missions in numerous countries. (Evangelism).
THE POINT IS ;; My Lord and Savior led / took me to a place and circumstance that I did not
know or could even imagine. He did so by – first; putting into my mind the purpose, second;
got my attention (fear- the only thing that would stop me in my life’s freeway), third; caused
me to move in obedience, fourth; guided step by step with sure directions (Clear
instructions – numerous road signs – provisions of circumstance and $$$). Before (that was
not the first) and MANY times since then the Lord has led in similar method. I am sure the
Lord leads in many ways (6 billion people on earth – 6 billion ways) ---- this is the way He
chose to lead in my life – He knows me best and how best to get my attention and guide me
where He wants His servant to go.
FOR ME --- OBEY – WHETHER OR NOT I UNDERSTOOD – COULD SEE IT – WANTED TO OR NOT
OR WHATEVER – OBEY !!!!
That process has led to many places around the world learning the POWER of our God and
After being at Lacey only 1 year 9 months the Lord showed me and then called me to
volunteer missions. The church was doing so wonderfully and my family and I loved that
place so much that I just could not imagine leaving. Many things (some miraculous)
happened to bring me to the place of decision. One day, desperately struggling in my spirit, I
went to the alter in the auditorium, was lying on the floor (as was my custom) pleading with
my Lord. I was talking audibly to Him and reasoning with Him about not needing to leave
Lacey at this time – all the things that were going on and needed to be done, etc. At one
point, it was so intense that I said, ‘I need some relief’ – immediately I got some relief – VERY
QUICKLY I said, ‘NO LORD I WANT TO KNOW’ I want to know’. (Remember when I was a
teenager – ‘leave me along’ – never say that again). Brings tears to me eyes just to write
Then the Lord spoke to me and said VERY CLEARLY -- ‘ you heard me – you understood me
– now are you going to obey or disobey’. I replied, ‘I will obey --- I will go to the last nickel’.
(Volunteer = no salary – I had money, I did not have ask anyone to buy a ticket.)
Our mission work has been tremendous blessings and adventures beyond anything I could
have imagined !!!
Approximately 3 years after leaving FBC Lacey we were in Garden Grove, California. We had
a group of collage age young people working from a local Baptist church, doing evangelism
in a low-rent housing development. With our team we did Bible studies and puppets. Our
puppet team was quite good. We applied for, auditioned and was accepted to be part of an
international Sister-City program between Los Angeles and Guangzhou, China. On May 1,
1986 (8th anniversary of ministry) we loaded our puppet team at LAX for a 1 month tour of 5
cities and 5 performances in China. As they were leaving, I gave them all the money I had
except a few $$s change. They became the tour’s main attraction – their program was
televised from Guangzhou University on Chinese National TV. They sang a Christian song as
part of their puppet show – they were told it was the 1st on Chinese National TV.
After we left the team at the airport, we drove to Redlands, California to meet a lady who was
offering us a place to stay while our team was in China. She showed us a very nice double-
wide in an orange grove – free of charge. As we, my wife, 2 of our younger children & I were
visiting Mrs. Voss in her driveway, her neighbor drove up. WE were introduced to the
neighbor, Denise. She didn’t get out of the car – only spoke and then drove away. We
returned the next day and moved into the trailer in the orange grove – it was a good place –
provided by my Lord. I went to a Kroger store, because I could buy food stuff and pay with a
credit card. (Old days regular grocery stores didn’t take credit cards). At the check out
counter, my credit card bounced – overloaded – no credit. I paid with cash – I had $3.57 left.
That evening I called a pastor friend, Dave. He was a by-vocational pastor. He knew of our
volunteer work and had told me on several occasions that if I ever needed help / work, just
call him – he always had something. I called – Dave said – Man!!, I always have something,
but right now I do not have a thing. Soo – I was sitting in a borrowed recliner – 1200 miles
from family or prospect for help -- thinking, what am I going to do now?? I picked up my Bible
and began to read – the kids were watching TV – Nancy was preparing supper. I stopped
reading and prayed – ‘Lord what am I supposed to do now??’ HIS ANSWER CAME
IMMEDIATELY – “STUDY REVELATION”. I answered quickly – ‘I will’. I turned to Revelation
and begin to read – read it all that evening. I had studied Revelation before, read many
books about it – I had even preached through Revelation at Jourdanton. I had studied it
before, but I knew a lot of questions that I didn’t have answers for.
Arising early the next morning, I read the whole book again – Nancy got up to prepare
breakfast about 8:00 and I went into the orange orchard to walk. A car turned in the
driveway. I recognized it as the neighbor we had met 2 days before. Denise saw me in the
orange grove – stopped, got out and started walking toward me. She promptly handed me an
envelope. I folded it and put in my shirt pocket. After talking about nothing for a few
moments, Denise said, ‘That is a check in the envelope. I don’t want to embarrass you--, but, I
believe the Lord led me last night to give you that for food -- Is that right? I answered,
‘Lady, I don’t know how you understand God, but you can go home, make a mark on your wall
and say – today I got it right. The next day she returned , gave us another check and told us
that the Lord had led her to give her tithe to our support as long as we were there in
Redlands. Our Lord miraculously provided (through others also) for us for 1 year – studying
Revelation 24 – 7. Since May 1986 the study of Revelation has dominated my life.
THE GREATEST OF BLESSINGS !!!!!!!
A year or so after the events in Redlands we were back in Texas. Our then son-in-law had a
job that called for a trip in an eighteen-wheeler truck of about 700 miles. He asked if I would
like to ride along and I agreed. On the return leg of the trip, on interstate 10 in the area of
Junction, Texas, I was driving, my son-in-law was in the sleeper asleep. In my Revelation
studies, I had gotten to chapter 20 verses 4 – 6 --- the millennial explanation. I had been
stuck there / studying that for at least a couple of weeks. As I was driving, I was rehearsing
Revelation in my mind – at that point I had the book virtually memorized. I had not attempted
to memorize, but I could begin at chapter 1 verse 1 and follow the entire book without
opening the Bible. At that time, I was struggling with what I had read and been taught for
those many years about the millennial. In that context, I was talking to the Lord aloud and I
asked Him, ‘If then the millennial is spiritual – how does all the other scriptures fit into that’.
Instantly the Holy Spirit filled me and the truck. The scriptures that I knew well began to flow
/ roll through my mind. It made complete sense --- they all fell into place.
As I was driving (about 3:00AM) in that state of ‘joy in the Lord’ there appeared in my sight to
the left, in the median of the freeway a horrible vision. It was the head / the bust of satan.
He was glaring at me and I felt that he wanted to kill me --- but he was outside and could not
get in. I understood CLEARLY that this was the opposition to the correct interpretation of
Revelation. After 30 years, I certainly can declare that to be true. With the correct
understanding of Revelation --- and that proclaimed to the ‘ends of the earth’ --- that is one
step closer to the end when satan’s death sentence will be carried out. He fights Revelation
There are many - many other proofs / evidences / testimonies that could be given to explain
my study of Revelation. I give these few hoping they are sufficient for you to understand;;
*** That I, Don English was not and am not capable nor did I desire to study Revelation.
*** I do not have a theological education that would qualify me to interpret Revelation.
*** I did not have an ambition nor desire to write a book about Revelation studies.
BUT AN ALMIGHTY – POWERFUL – AND HOLY GOD CALLED ME TO DO JUST THAT.
I was not capable – but He made me able.
I did not desire too – but He gave me the greatest task.
I was not educated – but He taught me.
I was not qualified – but He called me.
I did not have an ambition – but He lifted me every time I fell.
Many times I would have given up – wanted to give up – but every time my Lord would recall
to my mind that visionary face of satan – I would be renewed and continue.
It is time to interpret Revelation correctly.
It requires two things – much study -- guided by the Holy Spirit !!!!
Please refer to my website of Bible studies on difficult scriptures at::
www.spmint.com a study of Revelation
The bottom line ;;; To understand, to rightly discern God's calling.
True communication from the Lord must come from totally outside
yourself. The message must not be something you thought of, or
something you have seen, or something you heard or read -- (Something
you read from the Bible that applies to the message is confirmation), also,
not something someone else has told you or 'prophesied' about you --
(these can be conformations, but must be confirmed by the Holy Spirit
directly to you) --
My experience is that our Lord is VERY patient to give proofs / roads signs
to confirm His true message -- to give time for proof. (But, sometimes He
calls for 'right now' and gives strong evidence at these times). (Fear and
Please beware -- when the Lord begins to communicate with you -- satan
and the demons also hear. They begin immediately to question you, try to
deceive you, to test you. They have much practice -- all the way from the
Garden of Eden. God allows the testing and that is correct -- because,
having been tested your assurance of God's will is confirmed.
Remember -- God can speak -- in every language -- to any person.
If you have heard from God -- have proven it -- passed the test
you are not infallible -- but God IS infallible ----- stand on it.
If the Lord is reaching out to you / communicating with you, the time will
come when you will need to ask Him a question. The Lord brings you to
this point on purpose. His purpose is to initiate an interaction of thoughts /
communication -- because at every point -- it is your choice -- God never
takes away your freedom. (Example - Isaiah 6).
How I learned to ask a question;;; (A testimony)
I had, through much struggle determined that my Lord wanted me to move
from where I was -- so I began to ask, 'where do you want me to go'?? I
did not get an answer -- dead line. So - I learned, that is not the way to ask
in this particular case. (Its a big world -- too many possibilities). Then I
began to ask about places where I had been AND places that came to my
mind. I began, 'Is it Mexico' -- waited - no answer -- Belize -- waited - no
answer -- several more places and then hesitantly asked, 'Is it China'.
Instantly the Holy Spirit flooded me and the room and there was -- no
doubt that He was calling me to go to China. I said to Him, 'But China is
communist - missionaries can not go there -- I will do my best to find a
way. Two years later, 1986, we sent our puppet team to China.
Interesting note --- the road to China went through Mexico. My Lord had
shown me the goal to strive for -- but it took a lot of doing to get there.
Explanation ;; ---- When asking our Lord a question -- ask it in such a way
that the answer must be a 'yes' or a 'no'. Ask the question -- wait -- if you
have a positive / at peace feeling in your spirit -- the answer is yes. If your
spirit is troubled -- the answer is no -- or maybe, wrong question. When
you come to the question / answer phase -- you MUST be sure that your
spirit is in tune with the Holy Spirit. (TEST EVERY SPIRIT).
PLEASE NOTE -- OUR GOD AND CREATOR WILL WORK WITH YOU IN
YOUR CIRCUMSTANCES AND WILL WORK HIS WILL IN YOU.